BILROCK-161
DATE OF INTERVIEW:
12/03/2007
1- NAMES USED:
BILROCK-161, BIL, SAGE, CLIME-2, POST-182, GRUNT, BILLY-82
2- YEAR STARTED WRITING? YEAR RETIRED?
Started writing BILLY-82 in 1972 on the Upper
Westside but only in 1974 did I start to take
writing seriously. By then I was writing SAGE
and was a member of The Soul Artists, and
The Underground.
3- AGE WHEN YOU STARTED WRITING?
I was 10 or 11 when I first started writing.
4- WHERE?
I began on the Upper Westside of Manhattan.
5- WHY DID YOU START WRITING?
Writing was big on the Upper Westside when I
was growing up. I remember seeing the
neighborhood bombed by writers like: SNAKE-1,
STITCH-1, JUNIOR-161, FDT-56, BARBARA-62, EVA-62,
CRAZY CROSS-136, EL MACABRO, MOUSEY-89, CAT-87,
and others.
I started writing because all the kids in the hood
and in school were doing it. I was especially
inspired by ALI-105, TAKI-149, STEVE-161, COCA-82
and MALTA , all brother members of The Soul Artists.
It was like a form of protest to me, also it was like
a special brotherhood to be a member of. We all seemed
a lot more politically aware back then not like the
later writers from the post 1984 period.
6- WHO WERE YOUR WRITING PARTNERS (IF ANY)?
STILL IN TOUCH WITH THEM TODAY?
I had many partners over time but most were my RTW.
Or SA.
Brothers like: REVOLT, MIN-ONE(aka.NE), QUIK, SIE-1,
HUGHIE-167, REGAL-192, WAR-1. Later I partnered with
writers like: T.KID-170, FUZZ-ONE, and SIKO.
I recently began getting back in touch with several
writers, some I have not spoken to in over 20 years.
A few writers I have always managed to stay in touch
with like my man; REVOLT, WAR-1,and COCA-82.
7- WRITING CREWS YOU FOUNDED OR CO-FOUNDED?
I started The Rolling Thunder Writers(RTW.) in 1976.
The name was inspired by the Native American Healer:
Rolling Thunder. My older sister Andrea used to work
for the American Indian Movement(AIM.), and she had a
book about him.
I was also one of the founding members of
The Vamp Squad(TVS.)along with MIN-ONE, T.KID-170,
RIN-1, SHOCK-123,
and WAR-1.
8- WRITING CREWS YOU BELONGED TO?
I belonged to several starting with The Soul Artists(SA.)
in 1974, The Underground(UND.), TVS.,TNB.,BYB.,OTB.,
TFP.,POG.,NCB.,TSS.,ROC. and of course my crew; RTW.
9- YOU WROTE YOUR FIRST TIME ON A WALL, BUS, TRAIN OR
TRUCK?
Definitely on a wall, and then likely on the buses.
When I was a young writer back in 1972-74 hitting the buses
was bigtime. I used to rock the M10, M11,M7, M79, and
M86 lines. I didn’t start going to the train yards and
lay-ups until early 1977, and that was definitely the
1-train.
10- YOUR FIRST TAG EVER - WHICH MEDIUM DID YOU USE,
i.e. MARKER, SPRAY PAINT, PEN, ETC.?
I most likely used either an old El Marko or one of those
dri mark glass “toys”.
11- WHERE DID YOUR WRITING NAME COME FROM?
The name SAGE I took from watching Kung-fu flicks
on 42nd st., and in Chinatown. A Sage was a wise
spiritual type of leader and those films were full
of them. I suppose at that young age this is how I
saw myself(kids…hmm..).
I didn’t start tagging the name BILROCK-161 until 1978.
My boys HUGHIE-167 and HUNT-167 gave me that name,
they just started callin me that and it stuck. I had
an aunt whom I used to stay with often and she lived
on 161st and Bway., that’s where the number came from.
That was cool cause it also turned out to pay homage to
one of the writers who had first inspired me:
STEVE-161(RIP)
12- WHICH WAS THE FIRST TRAIN LINE YOU TAGGED?
(IF YOU TAGGED TRAINS)
The Broadway local #1 train
12A- WHAT OTHER MAJOR LANDMARKS DID YOU TAG?
I wasn’t big on landmarks but I loved hitting the
construction walls in Central Park which seemed to
have been up for years. On the trains, by the end
of my writing times I hit every line except for the
4’s, and the J’s.
14- WHAT YARDS & LAYUPS DID YOU WORK AT?
I loved the 1 tunnel, the D yard, the “Ghost yard”,
RR City hall lay up, The Pitkin ave. A yard, and my
favorite the AA yard(tunnel)where I would catch B’s,
and CC’s as well.
15- WHERE YOU 'KING' OF "SOMETHING"? (TRAIN LINES,
WALLS, ETC.?)
Without a doubt I was briefly the King of the RR during
1978. I was King of the AA train in 1979. The CC train in
1979-80. Always a major player on the 1 train, the D train,
and big on the A trains.
16- WHO WAS YOUR MENTOR? (IF APPLICABLE) DID YOU MENTOR
ANY OTHER WRITERS?
Without a doubt my main mentors were ALI-105(President of SA.),
and STEVE-161.
17- WHICH WRITERS DID YOU LOOK UP TO? WHY?
I looked up to several writers besides my above mentors.
I was in awe of writers like TRACY-168, TAKI-149, CLIFF-159,
JESTER, PNUT-2, PEACE-108, STIM-1, FLINT-707, LSD-OM,
BILLY-167, CHI CHI-133, ROD-1, MOSES-147, FDT-56,
RIFF-170 If it wasn’t because of their style ability then
it was due to their sheer ability to bomb and stay up for
long periods of time.
I was definitely a writer who was influenced by the 1973-75
period. The 3 yard boys were a big influence, many of them
were also SA. Members. Later on I dug the work done by the
M.G.Boys, and NOC-167, PART-1, REPEL-1.
18- DID YOU INTRODUCE ANYTHING NEW TO THE
WRITING MOVEMENT? IF 'YES,' WHAT WAS IT? WHAT YEAR?
I don’t think I introduced much that was new besides
maybe my floater throw-ups which I’d write down the car
sideways. I never saw anyone do that prior.
19- HOW LONG WOULD YOU GUESSTIMATE THAT EACH
GENERATION OF WRITERS LASTED?
A writer's career usually would only last about
3 years, some maybe 5. I wrote for 8 years. Guys
like BLADE, IZ, FUZZ-1, QUIK and MIN-ONE wrote
stupid long, bless them.
20- WHICH WERE YOUR FAVORITE COLORS TO WORK WITH?
I loved those Rustoleum colors and the old Red devil
paint. Krylon baby blue, schoolbus yellow were also fly.
21- WHICH BRAND OF SPRAY PAINT WAS YOUR FAVORITE TO WORK
WITH?
Rustoleum was my favorite but I wasn’t always so “choosy”
about it. Paint like the Wetlook was also the bomb.
22- WHICH MARKER WAS YOUR FAVORITE?
Without a doubt the Pilot. I preferred a nice flooded
pilot with a big fat stabbed tip.
23- WHICH WAS YOUR FAVORITE SPOT TO TAG YOUR NAME IN
TRAIN SYSTEM? (IF APPLICABLE)
On the insides I used to love to hit the spot above the
train maps, and also the doors. Lots of people daily go
through those in-between doors and I used to think it was
a good spot to be seen by many. I also loved those
staircase ceilings in the old stations.
24- DO YOU HAVE IN MEMORY A "FAVORITE" MASTERPIECE
THAT YOU DID? IF 'YES,' WHICH ONE? WHEN? WHERE? WHY?
One of my favorite cars was on the AA train which was a
memorial to all those who fought and died in the
Vietnam war on both sides. It was not pro-war,
I was very antiVietnam war.
I grew up during that jive war which was just another
excuse for some rich fat cats to line their pockets
via military-industrial complex business as usual.
I have deep respect for those that did have to go and
fight that war, they were mostly poor people.
I also equally respect those that fled to Canada or
Sweden due to their anti-war beliefs. Not only do
I think it was one of my better cars but I am proud
that it wasn’t just about my ego.
25- WERE YOU EVER ARRESTED FOR WRITING? IF 'YES,'
WHEN? WHERE? WITH WHOM? BY WHOM?
I was arrested once for writing and that was when
I was just starting out in 1974. I was motion tagging
on the 2 train with DAVID-80(aka.THC-OM), AD, and BE-3(3YB).
We were just around the Times Square station when BE-3
pointed out two undercover cops(DT’s) among the straphangers
in the car we were in.
Neither cop saw us tagging but it was obvious we were
writers. Upper Westside writers(members of SA.,TR.,UND.,
WIN.,etc..)
In those days, we almost had a kind of “uniform”.
We wore carpenter pants which had that tool pocket
on the hip which was perfect for a pilot. We had army
“Ike” jackets which we would carry our uni’s or midi’s
in the front pockets, also flomaster cans would fit in
them too. We had ink all over ourselves so it was obvious.
When the train pulled into times square we all tried to
break into different directions to get away but they had
radioed cops on the platform. We all got caught except for
BE-3 who hightailed it onto the streets upstairs.
In those days(1974) we were experiencing the first big
crackdown on writing and when you got busted they would
sentence you to a couple weekends of cleaning all the tags
off of the train stations. That was a joke cause it
ended up like a little writers convention, an opportunity
to network, meet different writers, etc. My boy SIE-1 was
there, he had gotten busted just recently. AD’s cousin ROD-1
was also there.
It was crazy, everyone was showing off their blackbooks to our “escorts”, the cops.
26- WHICH WAS YOUR FAVORITE PLACE TO GET PAINT FROM?
In the early days you could rack at all the neighborhood
hardware stores and Woolworths. As time went on it became
more difficult and you would have to do a little traveling.
Art stores in wealthy white neighborhoods like the upper-
eastside, and murray hill were always good. In my final
years of writing(1980-83) we would go all the way out to
towns in long Island or Westchester county.
We would end up robbing the entire towns spraypaint supply
as well as a decent portion of their coffee and olive oil
(to finance the cheeba and 40’s). I have to admit that being
white made it a lot easier to get over, my black and latino
brothers had it tougher.
27- WHICH IS THE CORRECT NAME FOR THIS ART FORM:
GRAFFITI ART? AEROSOL ART? WRITING? GRAFFITI? WHY?
I definitely agree that the term Graffiti is a some
what derogatory title. In the old days we definitely
called ourselves “writers”, however with all the time
which has passed it seems the term “graffiti” is here
to stay. It doesn’t bother me really, but I do equate
it with like….when in the 1960’s the media started to
call all the free-thinkers “hippies”. We never called
ourselves that and felt it was derogatory.
Today when one thinks of a hippie they almost always
equate it with a white elite type of bohemian who is
vegetarian, and wears birckenstock sandals. This is
because of the media and society at large. I recall
that in those days(60’s-70’s) we came in all races,
religions, and genders, and I always loved eating
cheeseburgers and Cuban sandwiches. Most of all you
wouldn’t catch me dead in open toe footwear.
So I understand how titles are misleading and worse,
derogatory and prejudiced. I believe that the term
aerosol art is good but we used to be “writers” at
one time. With all that said I don’t really feel
offended at the term graffiti nor hippie anymore.
28- ARE YOU STILL WRITING / PAINTING TODAY? IF YOU USE
CANVAS, YOUR FEELINGS ON PUBLIC SURFACE -VS- CANVAS?
I haven’t wrote since 1983 but I do have a nice supply of
spraypaint and I have been itching to use them. I am first
and foremost an Artist, a Painter and I have been doing that
most of my life. Due to my personal struggles with drug
addiction I didn’t paint anything for over 16 years, but that
has changed now that I am no longer a slave to drug abuse.
I have been painting prolifically again since late 2005.
My feelings about painting on a public surface like walls
(or transit!)have never changed, I believe in the people
having their own free art museum. The subways were the best
cause it was like a traveling art show for all the people.
29- WHY DO YOU THINK IT IS THAT AFTER ALL THE
EVOLUTION THAT WRITING HAS EXPERIENCED SINCE ITS
BEGINNINGS IN '69-'70, EVOLUTION THAT INCLUDES
ACCEPTANCE AND ADAPTATION BY YOUTH WORLDWIDE,
EVEN ACCEPTANCE BY SOME GOVERNMENTS OUTSIDE
THE U.S., THE POWERS THAT BE IN THE U.S.
STILL CONSIDER THIS CULTURE AS ONLY AN EYESORE?
IS RACISM TO BLAME? CLASSISM? OR BOTH?
Racism is definitely a factor due to its ugly,
systemic instituitionalization in the American
culture. Class is more the reason though and this
is evident in the origins of writers, we came in
all colors and what we had in common in the begining
was poverty.
America fears all forms of expression from the
lower classes, as well as those by free-thinkers
from the upper classes who join them. The U.S.A.
seems to have a hard time dealing with the death
throws of “the cult of the white male”.
30- DO YOU CONSIDER WRITING AN "ART FORM"?
Without a doubt writing is an art form.
31- WHAT DO YOU THINK OF SCRACHITI?
Scrachiti is the mega-whack!
32- WHAT DO YOU DO PROFESSIONALLY TODAY?
I am a licensed Private Investigator in New York
state, I work for criminal defense attorneys.
33- ANY ADVICE TO YOUNG WRITERS WORLDWIDE TODAY?
Yeah, my advice is to drop the puffy heads and just do
your art. Most of all remember where you come from.
I don’t even know where to begin about “selling out”
it has unfortunately become the norm. Its one thing to
do your art and to sell your art but to sell your soul
to some diabolical corporate entity is like pissing on
where you come from. Also know the history, study it,
respect it.
34- ANYTHING ELSE YOU'D LIKE TO ADD?
Yeah, Peace-Love-Unity!
35- YOUR CONTACT INFORMATION?
I can be reached at MySpace.com/Bilrock-161(aka.Sage),
or through REVOLT at revolt@ny.trash.com
Send E-Mail to: micoaslatinpride@gmail.comCopyright © 2009 MICO ~as~ LATIN PRIDE!. All Rights Reserved